It is better to decide not to write comments about Idayanal Achan's "velipadu" about church dispute, because everybody knows who is Idayanal Achan and What does he want.
Very well Done Idayanal Chor-Episcopa!!The Perpertual/habitual Liars like H.B.Thomas I and his counterparts modern Jacobites resembles the old testament Jacob Who cheated his own father Issac and brother Esavu for the blssings of his father and wealth. For self existence and self glorification H.B. ThomasI and his counterparts always try to play around with mafia politics in Malankara. Moolyail,Kuriakose Chor-Episcopa in his writings to his fellow Jacobites always insist that there were no tomb for Abded Messiah Patrtriarch in Kurkunmel Daira! KanaiyamParambil Chor Episcopa famous for his "Kappi canon" It is true and real"ALWAYS TRUTH SHALL TRIUMPH" also note thatL/L H.H. Yakkob III was not only infamous for his Bull of 1970 whereby he made heretic teachings against St.Thomas The apostle and his Priesthood, while consecrating L/L H.H. Augen I as Catholicose in 1964 he made the Shaumulsa of Mor Augen, under the throne St.Peter in Antioch, For catholicose in Malankara Orthodox Church.Antioch Partriarch L/L Yakkob III is another fraud and deception!!!
Dear Joshy It is not "Velipadu",What ever he he has told is the truth!! You cannot accept the truth!! We don't want you to comment in MOSC/IOC blog/forum without proper reasons!!
great work by Edayanal Achan... congrats achan and keep it up...what he wrote is exactly right. Thomas pradhaman is still mis leading his people. the poor people still believes thomas catholica's nonsense words. thats what his success. Once i got an apportunity to attend the holy mass in one of their (puthencruz soceity's) church in north side. after the holy mass the vicar started his speech. in his speech he made a comment like this "makkale, methran kakshikkarkku pathrose sleehaaye ishtamalla, karanam, nammude zakka 1 thirumeni irikkunnathu pathrosinte simhasanathil aanu"".. see the level of blunder and poison they are injecting on common people. this will still continue. avaru vithakkunnathu orikkal avarkku thanne koyyendi varum....
Joshy Please do not see matters with a projudiced mind. Study his docuement with a clear mind and see it got some reason. Only that attitude will help us solve problems.
I stay with MOSC basically for two reasons:
1. Patriarch who stays in Arab territory shoulo dbe responsible for Arab Christians
2. The governance of Indian church (for 120 crore Indians) should be done by Indians only.
I am least bothered about any other issues
Basically each one should be responsible for the mission work to be done in his own country. How can the Arab bishops who do not want to work in their own land become masters of 120 crore Indians. (I said this because all nations will turn to JESUS). All Orthodox churches are national churches. Why can't we have it in India. What have Arabs done to us to shout: "AMMAYE MARANNALUM ANTHIOKIAYE MARAKKOOLA"
I had attended just one Church service of jacobite when I went for a baptism. As you said the priest made a long speech about Antioch and their glory and criticised the MOSC. So this may a regular and routine affair in the Jacobiet churches. Poor people have been fed with this misinformation! I think they are awakennig as the 8th Ausgust meeting in Alwaye proved.
I Feel most of the things written by Edayanalachan is true. throgh this small article ,he explained the back ground of the factional feud in the Malankara church in simple words. I am an orthodox follower,but still wish to see the unity in the malankara church.iam sure the leaders of both factions who misguided the church will be punished in the final Judgement of our Lord .
Edayanal kori has given a challenge at the end of his "historical blunders".... That he will leave the metran kakshis if any of his " findings " are proved to be wrong..
Joice .. Please ask him if this challenge given in 2004 is still valid ? If it is still valid , Koriyachande charithra bodham njangal thiruthi tharam..
I have nothing to say about Edayanal achen writings.
Nobody in this world is perfect whether it is Patriach faction or Catholicose faction. Human beings are bound to make sins. Ultimate aim for all is to attain eternal salvation.
Here, the fundamental of both faction i.e. Patriarch & Catholicose faction are totally different. Hence, church unity is impossible. Faith of both factions cannot be compromised. So it has to be divided.
For all knowledge, Churches in Malankara are run by palli committee members & decision taken by palli pothuyogham of that particular church. Bishops have only spiritual powers & rites to do rituals.
In this regard those churches which are run by Patriarch faction will be under Patriarch of Antioch and those churches which are run by Catholicose faction will be under Catholicose devalokam. Catholicose of devalokam don’t have any rite to interfere the administrative matters of Patriarch churches. It seems that Catholicose of devalokam need all the property where the cross is found.
Dear Joshy & Mathew, Gone are those days that you can simply counter argue on true facts. Today the people on your side are literally fed up with baseless utopian stories published by Antiochian viswasa Samrakshna Samithi which says that Christianity was brought to India by Antiochian Fathers. Ofcourse it was in Antioch christians were called so but when you blind fold link that to your Arabi Patriachs and Patent Antioch as your private property the problem starts and that is the whole issue we have today in our church. To prove Edayanalachen wrong, you may have to eat atleast 200 Onams in your life. What are you asking Joice about Edayanalachen's challege is it still valid? You mean to say that you will not prove it wrong if the challenge is not valid? What does that mean? just Tit for tat. Don't try to cover hole with darkness - that typical Arabi brain.
Edayanalachan has succeeded in narrating the brief history in a very simple language. But from here what? It is time we must stop logical exercises and ascertain ways and means to accommadate the other faction. We had been wasting the last 15 years {since 1995} trying to establish our strong points.But we have missed everything. I mean we have missed our mission and vision.If we sidetrack our mission and vision, what purpose can be served by a history? Yes, a favourabe history too will not favour us. Our blunders all these years are not sufficient for us to learn. Atleast from now, we should keep history in our back pocket and look forward to put into practice what we preach on sundays and what we recite through our promeons and sedaras. Can Edayanalachan take a lead? I am sure if there is a will, there is a way. BUT THE WILL MUST BE THERE. Otherwise, history is waste. As far as I understand, Edayanalachan is capable enough to take the initiative to end up in a unified single Orthodox Church in Malankara. ## George Joseph
Edayanalachen's didn't switch camps. For that matter I too. We embraced unity. Not any particular faction. There will always be people who doesnot like peace. They worked through poor Cheruvally & Perumbally who wanted to become Bishops. The families of those people who were against peace in our church are almost extinct. If we see Cheruvally today as a leader is only because he was cheated by those who were against peace. So like the robber who confessed at the last momement Cheruvally and Perumbally will still find a place in heaven. But those who were really against peace in church will suffer. Personally I know Edayanalachen will be the last to create a division in our church. But at the same time he will be the last to sacrifice truth and that is the reason why many of us feel that he is admant.
If we are talking about unity then all Christian should/must come under one umbrella. Will this happen ? All belive in trinity. Why all christians be under one single head. It cannot happen, rather it is very difficult. Similar is the case of Patriach faction & Catholicose faction of devalokam.
Whole humanbeing are sinner, all have to repent prior leaving this world to get eternal life. It is not just Cheruvally and Perumbally, but we all, even the Devalokam catholicose.
Dear Jacobite Brotheres There is no Blunderes The Idayanal Chor- Episcopa had written.The Blunders are Created by Some People Claiming Throne for St.Peter in malankara. Read Bible and Think properly in any Place has Christ appointed St.Peter as Supreme Leader of Dicsiples or whether Christ has told the disciples to follow St.Peter! Peter and The Rest of disciples were told to follow the Risen Christ. Who is The Risen Christ?All the authorieies in Heaven and Earth belongs to Christ. The Rock is Christ!! or Christ is The Rock!! St.Paul clearly stated this in his Epistles. St.Paul was not ordained By St.Peter. St.Peter recognised st.Paul as himself(peter) and treated as an Apostle Like Peter himself. Idayanal achan talked about the heretic teachings/heresy of Jacobites and the wrong teachings(history )Sunday school history/lessons of Jacobites.
Sometimes back(2007) I wrote to Mar Dionyasuis of Manjinikkara(jacobite Bishop)to give me details of Ordination of St.Paul as per Acts 13:1-2 whereby he refused to give me a response of my query. he knows the truth. The faith of both factions basically are the same and no difference except throne of St.Peter and supremacy of Antioch Partriarch. Even The Roman Catholics who claim succession of st.Peter,do not remember the Holy fathers St.Peter,St.Paul or St.Clement or St. Julius on their Sunday Holy Masses/Holy Communion! There are no special prayers for invocation of Holy Spirit like Orthodox Qurbana in their(R.C./L.C.)Holy Communion. H.B. Thomas I even made a bull banning/prohibiting Jacobites in receiving/paricipating Holy Qurbana of MOSC. This is called Hypocracy of Jacbites/Puthencruez society! There are no churches built by antioch partriarch In Malankara. The Malankara churches are governed/administered by MOSC constituition of 1934. Those who formed society in 2002 cannot claim any ownership of church property of Malankara. For disputed Churches there are court cases and both parties should respect court orders verdicts/judgement as per the law of our country. There is no need to conduct rally/protest/march, every now and then and proclaim publically we are for peace and true followers of Christ!
Both factions should prove that they real followers of Christ rather than publically accusing each other!
Edayanal Achen should be a Metropolitan.Is there any way a married priest can be a Metropolitan..? if cant we all should lobby to change the law.So Edayanal can be a Metroplolitan and a Catholicos later on.He is a Genius and smarter than all the Metropolitans we have.May god bless him.There is other Priests who are very smart but cant be a Thirumeni or Catholicos just because they got married.It is not fair and we should change that practice.
Thank you very much for your comment. For your information, There is no faction in Malankara Church. The Hon'e SUPREME COURT upheld the 1934 constitution and under the supervsion of the apex court the election to the office of the Malankara Metropolitan was held. Justice Malimut was appointed as the observer and he supervised everything. After the election, Justice Malimut declared Catholocose Marthoma mathews II as the Metropolitan of the Church. Some people who also paid the Observer's fee did not participate and became rebels. Later they registered theselves as group under the Society act. Whatever be their claim about the status of the Patriarch in Malankara, the SC had ruled that the status of the Patriarch was in accordance with the 1934 constitution of the Church.
So I hope you understand that There is only one and only one Malankara Church.
We are only concerned about the unity of the Orthodox faith and Church in India. We are not concerned about the failure of the Arab churches.(PLEASE READ:NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC COVER STORY on Arab Christians on their website). But we are concened about rebels and extremists damaging the Church in our country. We stand for unity of the believers, we stand for India, our motherland. When the faithful desert the rebel leaders there is joy because CHURCH IS CHRIST'S BODY! So we are calling once again for UNITY and LOVE.
MORE and MORE BELIEVERS IN INDIA WILL DESERT ANTIOCH. I do not know where they will all join.
IF Antioch wants to maintain their Indian connection, they have to get the jacobite unified with the mother Church. Otherwise as generations pass by, there will not be anyone to support them from India. I think even before that happens, there will not be anyone in Damascus who call themselves as patriach, if things turnout like this for another decade or so.
I had read an article titled "20 reasons why futue will not hold for Antioch in India"
Fr Edayanal's book is very good, if his intent is to prove that the Catholicose faction is 100% justified and the Patriarch faction is 100% wrong. But if the intention is to create peace and unity, this book and discussions here are not helpful. When there is a difference of opinion or quarrel between two parties, and if the two parties still love each other and if the two parties want to attain unity, they boasting that I am 100% right and you are 100% wrong does not help. This is true in the case of two factions of the same church, it is true between husband and wife it is true in quarrels between two brothers.
If unity is what is desired, the first thing that is required is to understand the other side's perspective. The second thing that is required is to respect the other side.
In the book, Edayanal Achen has said that when Marthoma Church and the Malankara Church parted ways they didnt get anything. This is not true. The only church in which Marthoma Church was a majority, Maramon Church, they got it. In churches where Mathomites had sizable number, they got a turn to celebrate the qurbana.
Similarly after the coonan cross oath, when the Syro-Malabar Catholic rite seperated from the Malankara Church, they also got churches where they were a majority. Churches where the Malankara Nazranis were a majority was with us.
So the concept of giving ownership of a church based on majority has been done in the past in Malankara.
I sincierly hope that, we dont have to go to that extend. I believe if we can establish peace first and have mutual respect, unity will follow. It might take another 100 years for full unity and a united synod. Let us not wait for unity to have peace. Lets have peace now and mutual respect right now.
Most quarrels in Malankara happens because we are not looking farward. When we look forward, we see a nation of 120 crore people. What is role of Arabs here? They should look forward in Arabia, not in India. Arabs have no role to play in India. leave India to Indians. How can a Church which is on the decline in their own land help a nation of 120 crore.
I do not want to follow Antioch because they are a failed church. Alpathil viswsthan adhikathilum viswasthan. Antioch is not a responsible Church. How can be given charge in Indian Church?
When Patriarch Elias III came and told our parents that let us put an end to this division. We didn’t listen. The Kalpana he brought for peace was never read. Our Vayaliparambil Thirumeni was poisoned and died because he realized peace is what is needed and weeded all those were against creating more division after the peace in 1958. One of the latest breed in our family who is a Priest recently further denounced St.Thomas as Apostle. When he was questioned by me for that, he said, “jeevichu pokenday achaya’. So you guys discuss in SOCM or in VS or anywhere you like about me, I am least bothered. You can only say that there is no such person called Vayaliparambil Varghese Mathew in the whole universe and may even go to Panchayat Office to get the birth and death register to put up your claim. You want to see me. Come to Thrikkunathu Seminary Chapel. I am there most of the Sundays. Remember about the concern of the Jews when they realized that boy who was blind got his vision through Jesus. They went on arguing and arguing questioning his parents. They didn’t feel happy in the boy getting the vision. There were more concerned with the publicity Jesus got. This is the trouble you guys have. Even if the Syrian Patriarch excommunicate your society, you will still say Antiochyae marakoola. Because as Jesus said, you don’t know what you speak. So I am not in here for an argument with the dumb heads.
Dear Mathew You don't need to challenge anybody making comments here in this Blog.You can give facts/information against what Idayanal Achan said/wrote regarding the factional feud in Malankara.We allow you to make comments here, not like socm forum who are behaving like 'Jihad'. Can you give any history of Antiochean partriarch who visited Malankara /Kerala/Malabar prior to 1875.
If you have any historical knowlegde/back ground of "Malankara Nazrani" you can state that. Devalokam is not political party/Mafia or Propagating Violence/murder in church feud.
Also try to learn when,where the Title "Partriach" came in Church what was the position of Antioch Partriarch in the First three Ecumenical synods/ Universal synods held in Nicea,Constantinaples,Ephesus!! Where and when universal synod held for Syrian orthodox church accepted/changed the name into Universal syrian orthodox church!
Idayanal Achan's "velipadu" will go into oblivion one day the moment Devalokam Catholica decides to oust achan from thrikkunnathu semnay and be given in-charge of his home parish- pazhanthotttam because of the poor income for the IOC from that church. Fr. Jacob Mannaraprayil was a bigger lover of St. Thomas throne and critique of Antioch than Idayanal Achan till he was removed from the Seminary after 30 years of “income custodian” of the seminary. Now mannaraprayil achan has gone to Kasi to get Moksham, so one day Idayanal Achan will go to Haridwar to repent his current “velipadu”.
None of these people will talk about the GREAT MARCH IN ALWAYE ON 8th August.
Dear Joyce,please keep The Hindu and Mathrubhumi with you. VISWASASAMRASHAK wil come out with a 2 or 3 lakhs number soon. "Ennamaknkil enniko, Nale kallam paryaruthe"
Dear Valiaparmban
You are great . None can make it clear mor than you! You speak with a great PUNCH.
People like you should write books as it will help many others.
Dear Joshy You do not have any self respect for yourselves! Mannapra Chor-Episcopa did not Go To Kashy for For "Moksham"as purely a baseless claim by yourselves!He (MannaPra Jacob Chor -Episcopa)still with MOSC and I have participated in his Holy week celeberations in during March this year. You guys only know how to propagate issues like political parties by concealing the truth!This is how The Society people behave always!!There is no logic in your allegations!! You will repent one day for all your allegations!
Jacobite Dictionary [complied according to 2002 Society Constitution]
Fornightly: A publication released only once in a month
For expample: viswasa samrakshakan, a fortnighty of the Jacobite Church, is published only once in a month. If you have doubt, you can visit the site and be 'blessed'. http://www.viswasasamrakshakan.org/
ഹലോ മാത്യു , ഈ വെല്ലുവിളികള് ഒക്കെ ആരോടാ മോനെ. ഇതൊക്കെ ആണും പെണ്ണും കെട്ടവരുടെ പണിയല്ലേ. നമ്മുടെ തോമസ് പ്രഥമന് കാണിക്കുന്നത് കണ്ടു പടിക്കല്ലേ.
താങ്കള്ക്കു എന്തെങ്കിലും കാര്യങ്ങള് തെളിവ് സഹിതം പറയാനുണ്ടെങ്കില് മാത്രം പറയുക.
വെറുതെ ഞഞ്ഞാ മുഞ്ഞാ വര്ത്തമാനം പറയല്ലേ. അതൊക്കെ പണ്ട് നടക്കുമായിരുന്നു. അത് കൊണ്ടല്ലേ നാണം ഇല്ലാത്ത കുറെ പേര് ക്രിസ്ത്യാനികള് എന്ന പേരും പറഞ്ഞു ഇപ്പോഴും അറബികളുടെ പിന്നാലെ നടക്കുന്നത്.
Dear GeogyAbraham You are wrong from the beginning! If you have nothing to comment on What Idayalal Chor-episcopa wrote you should have left the issue without commenting. Actually you do not know What is Orthodoxy or What is the Faith MOSC.Without knowing thses basics how can you comment? we did not force/ make you to comment!You do not even know How did two faction came in Malnkara church,the cause,or the events/circumstances led to split.
There are two things you must know (1)The Teachings/commandments of Jesus Christ(bible). (2)Malankara Church history from A.D.52.you did not try to understand these two things yet make comments on Blog isuue here as if somebody compelled you to do so!! It Is not church Committe/Church Agm take the stand to which group /faction a particular parish is going to Join /stand. Before even India got independance, Malankara church had a valid constituition whereby all individual parishes/churches are to be governed/administered. In Malankara the division is initially created By Antiochean Partriarchs for temporal power. Partriarch of antioch got spiritual authority in Malankara subject to 1934 constituition and canon of the church. Jesus never appointed/authorised St.Peter As supremehead of His Church on earth or His(peter's) successors in Antioch (Partriarchs) The divided factions united as one in 1958 and until 1970,there were no problems in Malankara church.Then the disgruntled Partriarch Yakoob III,and some of his allies in Malankara started creating division again,blaming Augen I bava for nothing! It is not Devalokam bava alone or the Shrestan(H.B of Jacobites/P.cruez)Even The Partriarch Of Antioch are there to stand before God for causing all troubles in Malankara Church for as these Spiritual leaders are supposed to behave like real followers of Christ (god)who humbled himself as a servant/ human being,walked with obedience all the way to death in cross(read Philip 2:5-8) and not of this world(read 1Corin 10-13;3:3-9) St. paul clearly taught the church in corinth regarding division. now who created this division in Malnkara and for what? Think twice before stoning the MOSC or its Bava!
I happened to read an article written by Mr. Biju K Varghese in Malankarasyriacvoice.com. I would like to attend the conclusion part of his message:
In fact there is nothing new in that artcle. Supreme Court accepted/ approved 1934 constitution. So whatever Supreme court mentioned is based on 1934 constitution. Spiritual supremacy of Patriarch, etc are part of that constitution only. If both party are ready to accept this constituion there will not be any problem. As he is explaining things just as similar to what is already there in 1934 constitution I think Mr. Biju K V is ready to accept 1934 constitution.
During 1995 judgment honorable Supreme court approved 1934 constitution without any objection as there was not even any constitution to defend it from the other party. Also there was not even any defending Catholicos as there was only one catholicos at that time, ie; HH Baselious Marthoma Mathews II. And the reason for this absense is none other than H.B Thomas I ( that time HG Thomas Mar Divannasious) and his divisive nature though today he is acting like an innocent.
HB Thomas I is a crooked, cunning person born for division whether it is in same group or for the opposite group and a curse for the Malankara Christianity.
And finally he used a term "eunach" in his article to call someone. I wonder who is the real eunuch. Whether it is the one who accepted 1934 constituion in court and stick to it or those who accepted 1934 constitution in court and denied in public.
thanks Edayanal Acha.... in fact, most of the MOSC Christians also not aware of this things. but one doubt remains, why we are not getting a clear cut verdict from Courts if we are 100% right.
I think, the people who put comments here from cheruvally trust (puthencruz soceity,)have never gone thru the book of Edayanal Achan. Just by seeing the photo of Achan, they started barking, Saathan kurishu kanda pole... If they spent some time to read the book, definitely they will not behave like this. The administration and governance of MOSC is clearly based on one central stone, thats 1934 constitution which was accepted even by the jacobite faction in supreme court and lateron denied in public. It is not governed by any individuals under any family trust like cheruvally trust formed at puthencruz.
Howver, I have seen, someone under the same name, " Malankara Syriac Voice" posting nonsense in the SOC yahoo community.
If thats you, why dont you first practice what you preach.
Certainly these types of unruly news and then idiotic comments based on that, will only create further divisions. So why dont we all, who preach stop it and and give in a try to practice.
Edayanal Achen is not the Manager of Thrikkunathu Seminary. Achen is the Diocesean Secretary. There is no permanent post for any Achens in MOSC. Tomorrow Manaraprayal Achen could be the Manager or even the Diocesean Secretary. Whoever it may be, they are elected democratically and that is the difference between MOSC and P.S society.
The leaders who clamour for division of the Malankara Church are not visionaries. They fear unity will endanger their position in the Malankara Church.
I will give a parallel example: THE DIVISION OF INDIA was the most painful experience in the Indian History. India was divided into two because Muslim League leader under Jinnah wanted a Muslim state called Pakistan. They got it finally….Again Pakistan was divided and Bangladesh was formed. Now what is the state of affairs in Pakistan? It had military rule for decades.. Still the military is in control. No real democracy in Pakistan. Many regions in Pakistan are demanding further divisions --Sindh, Punjab, Baluchistan and many other regions. I don’t want to go into the details. Will Pakistan ever become a good nation..? I do not know. But not in the near future. Political analysts say, Pakistan could anytime fall into hands of Taliban the moment US stops supporting Pakistan. So we can imagine that Pakistan is in ICU.
Do our Jacobite brothers want the same fate for their church? When Pakistan was formed they thought they had everything… see what happened later… DIVISIVE LEADERS WILL GIVE BIRTH TO MORE DANGEROUS DIVISIVE LEADERS.
WE are all peace lovers. We want peace in the world, in the nation, in the state, and in the Church, family, in personal life,.. Everywhere.
In the Jacobite Church, decisions are taken by ONE PERSON. HH Didimos Bava cannot make anyone a bishop in the Malankara Church. But just one person can make anyone a bishop in the Jacobite church.
Students of world history know that after the fall of autocrats the nation broke. I am afraid the Jacobite Church is treading the same dangerous path. So Beware! So POLITICALLY SPEAKING the division of the Malankara Church is dangerous.
STRATEGICALLY, the unity of the church will benefit the Church. Think about the benefits of unity. Political leaders, some other Churches all want the Malankara Church to be divided because that serves their purpose well. They encourage Jacobite leaders because they know they are the leaders who demand division of the Church. Once they achieve the division they can destroy both.
Also, division will lead to further divisions. . The power greedy leaders will do anything to achieve heir objectives.
SPIRITUALLY SPEAKING, division of the Church is a sin because whoever divides the Church is crucifying Christ again.
Some leaders are spreading rumors creating fear in the minds of the people. They say that Didimos Bava will take away their churches and property. I request you to maka visit to any Malankara Church and see things for yourself. The administration of the Church is done by the Palli Pothuyogam.. Didimos Bava or any other metropolitan cannot not take away the church property. Their powers are limited to the spiritual areas and will administer the church according to the 1934 constitution.
I have full confidence in the faithful and believe that the Church will remain united. Let us respect and love all people in both the camps. Let us also pray for peace and unity in the Church and in the nation. That is the homage we can pay to our true leaders
Dear all PC society group always blame and find fault with MOSC.They always think that Antiochean Bava is their God and only through Antioch Bava priest hood is converged in Church of Christ!Simon Peter is rock and He was given the keys of kingdom of heaven,and he was told to feed the sheep ,tend the lamb,and feed my little sheep!. The don't take into account the context and real meaning of this verses.They never want to be told what exactly Jesus meant by these words.Jesus is the rock and he (jesus) is the corner stone! The apostles /prophets are foundations of Church .It is the faith Peter confessed "That Jesus is The Christ,Son Of Living God"Jesus told Peter This faith of Confession, was revealed to Peter By The Father in Heaven!! The Same Peter denied Jesus infront of other people three times.After resurrection,Jesus apperaed to Peter,and fellow apostles two times.In The Third time Jesus appeared on sea of Tiberias,where Peter and rest of apostles were fishing.Here Peter was reminded By Jesus his(Peter's ) Mission. Simon Peter was Called "Bar Jonah Simon-Simon, The Son Of Johna ".Peter was not called as Kepha/Peter By Jesus!! Simon Peter was unsteady disciple of christ since the arrest,trial and crucification of Jesus by jews and Pilate.although Peter saw the risen Christ two times he was still behaving like unsteadily guy! The word Johna means unsteadily person .Jesus called Peter as Simon son of Johna, on the third time appearance after Resuurection! Peter was restored and commissioned as subordinate Shepherd As Jesus is The True Shepherd(John10:10,14).Peter and other apostles are subordinate shepherds of Christ(1 Peter5:1-4).Again John in His epistles call himself an elder and address the faithful as Dear Little children,Young men,and and fathers(1john 2:12,13,14,15).therefore Peter has the same authority like all other apostles in church. The four orders in Church governmnt :laity,deacons,presbyters(elders)and Overseer(bishops)are indicated/described in varius Epistles of St.Paul and not in epistles of St.Peter.So the Antiochean Partriarchs who are successors of St.Peter cannot claim any supermacy in MOSC or other oriental orthodox Churches. Jesus Never gave any supremacy to Peter over other apostles.Likewise The MOSC was founded/established by St.Thomas the apostle, and the successors of of St.Thomas apostle,the Catholicose are not under the authority of Antiochean Partriarchs!
Three groups in the jacobite camp wants to divide the Church
1. UNMARRIED priests who want to become bishops. They know it is difficult to becoem a bishop without proper qualification and tough procedures in the Malankara Association
2. LEADERS, CHAVALLIERS, COMMANDERS who benefit from the Jacobite camp fear lossodf power and lesser glamour in the unified church
3. BIG Churches who want to have their own way. The TRUSTEES and othr local leaders have to adhere to teh principles and values. Itis ordinary member who will beneit when things are in order and run as per LAW. 3.
Beware of the jacobites masquerading themselves as PEACE MAKERS.
If they say that PEACE will come by division, then they are Jacobites.
HH Didimos Bava is like a Gandhi silently praying for unity and peace. HB Thoasm is like Jinnah who want to cut this Church into two pieces. God is with whom?
During teh time of Solomon, a lady wanted to cut the child bccasue she was no real mother. teh real mother begegd not to kill the baby. Thomas Thirumeni, how can you be so cruel. will forefaters who fought for the freedom of teh Church firgive you ever?
My dear antiochian freinds Attn: Respected editors in malankarasyriacvoice.com/ Is everything alright in ANTIOCH? Thomas Bav say ok becasue they have construvted a 70 room building (10 rooms for 1 person!)
if you want to know what is happening in Antioch, PLEASE 'READ World's TOP magazine called 'NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC'
I will give you a link to the COVERSTORY on ARAB CHRISTIANS (Ishmalites)
Followers of Jesus for nearly 2,000 years, native Christians today are disappearing from the land where their faith was born. PUBLISHED JUNE 2009
HB Thomas Bava started his research while he was in the Kolenchery medical college. HB's contribution on leadership and organisational skills are known world over. Recently HB has 'successfully' operated the Largest Ever gatherimg of his church in Kerala. (read the other posts for details)
While HB was metrolpolitan (?) in the Angamali diocese of the Jacobite rebels, he sent a registered legal notice to his own Catholicose (HB Paouluse Bava) asking him not to enter the churches in Angmali diocese and not consecrete anyone as priest under his diocese.
But he has not filed a sinle case against any one but there are 426 cases agaist Thomas Thirumeni. He never files cases as he is not confident about human courts. This is a a proof that he is a living Saint.
I think there is no point in wasting our time in answering to the commnets of Puthen soceity people. They are all successfully brain washed by Dr. Thomas catholica and they cannot be changed and they belongs to the gunda group "kefa". i know the cases of some of the churches in north side especialy in ernakulam district, where the kefa members stored weapons in their kefa offices. weapons means not guns or anything, items suitable to their culture ,like stones, iron rods, chilly powder, then provision for making hot water immediately. these are the items recently they applied on our priest and our people at Onakkoor church. one bishop is permanently appointed for giving training for using these items. when MOSC people conducted one rally at TVM few years back, some people had thrown stones to the police and the rally went wrong. that was a quotation given by a former minister who lost his minister post recently. this minister belongs to puthen soceity. Dr. Thomas catholica who is having the more number of cases against him when compare to Veerappan, is having the knowledge of all notorious criminal activities and his doctorate must be in such a subject. At Piravom church, the court has appointed three priests permanently and any other priests or bishops from either groups can never enter piravom valiya pally and everybody was following this court order. But few years back, Dr. Thomas catholica entered this church at midnight and he slept inside the Madhbha and next day morning even without taking a bath he did the qurbana. court order is not applicable for him?? then MOSC people filed a case against him for this, but he repeated this again, he enetered this church again as earlier. without creating any issues, MOSC people filed a case against him. but there was no movement from any authorities, because police was in his pocket. then Thomas mar athanasious thirumeni of Kandanadu east tried to enter this church at day time on a parunnal day, then all the kefa gunda pada from various churches came to the scene and created lots of issues, they even attacked thirumeni and the deacon who accompanied him. then the authorities reacted and both parties entered an agreement not to violate the rule. so even if we get a clear court order, these people will not obey that, because they belongs to Syria, Indian Law is not applicable for them, it seems. so the so called talks on unity is not an achievable one, other wise GOD has to do some miracle.
Dear Mathew, You should now attend classes taken by the latest in charge of the Antiochian movement. He is the latest Gibels. All these stories you narrated are that old Cheruvally edition. Write something new. You are writing to a person who accompanied Vayaliparambil Thirumeni to Devalokom after the 1958 peace treaty. And you expect me to take that thrash you wrote. Hope you don't tell your parents that they are not yours!
Thrikkunnathe achaya ( Ippozhum vayaliparambil veettuperu kootti vilikkan manassu varunnilla ).... aarum enne padipikkande kaaryamila... For me Syrian orthodox church is not Thomas I bava or Antiochean movement.. it is much beyond that..... athokke manasillakkiyathu sabha charithrathil othiri thaalparyamullathukkonda....
I was checking with vayaliparambil family members about the presence of a metran kakshi " kunjaadu " in their imediate faimly... None of them no somebody like that.. Ee Vayaliparamban ennu oru gamaykkku aalkaare patikkan vechekkunathaanno ? Vayaliparambil poyittu nedumbassery cheriya vayaliparambil ( avarkku Vayaliparambanmaarayitu rakthabandhamonnumilla ) polum oru metran kakshi kaaranilla ennannu ariyan kazhinjathu....
You should buy a copy of Kerala Charithram by Padmabhooshan A Sreedharamenon and read.
The independent historian of Kerala has lot to say about Kerala Christians. Then compare it with History as taught by Jacobite Chuch and Orthodox Church. Will you do this?
All nations wil know Christ. So all the people wil come to belive in God. Jacobites teach all true Christain shoud be under Arabi. So our nation will be under Araby? Ha ha ha what a foolish idea!
Arabs are ISHMALITES, and not of Abraham and Sarah
Dear Mathew, I told you a way to find me out. But Pothinodu vedam odiyittu karyam undo? You don’t have the time to realise the truth but have the time to enquire with each and every member of the family about a person who realized the truth. So don’t waste your time to find me out. Start writing a book that can be published by Antiochya Samarakshana Samithi (don’t expect any royalty) at least you can read it repeatedly when you reach my age and find solace in it. If you are so proud with what you have, why do you waste your time around here cursing Devalokam. Try to understand, Devalokam or Puthencruz is just less than one percent of the Kerala Population which we realise. Go and speak salvation amongst your heavenly creed at least they will find a place in heaven along with Judas. Oh you don’t have anything like that. Isn’t it? All revolves around that ‘Kya’ I mean Antio’kya’. Do you know Vellappaly Nadessan has got 2 crore followers in Andhra, I am sure if you guys go and fish around there and speak about this ‘kya’ you will get atleast 200. Why to propagate Gibels stories which even your people started shunning upon. May be you expect a ‘Chavaliar’ in the making! You people are making churches and bishops like Ulhasnagar duplicate products. If pradhaman was offered the position of Catholicos do you think tadpoles like you will open your mouth? Same happened during the time of Kuttikkattil Thirumeni. He was never consulted and considered for that position, as simple as that. To amicably solve these issues Puthencavil Thirumeni used to come here occasionally and one Jonie in your lot felt he went their for hospitality!. Nannum kettavande mattedathu………. Athum avanoru thanalla. He needs to know the story of that ‘champa marum’ which was in front of the Seminary, which this hospitality addicted kuttikattil thirumeni cut to prevent children from climbing on that tree. May be this is not there in your edition. I know being a Patriarch addicted guy once, the real color of that lot. You are still intoxicated with that. Are you guys still getting karuppu when those guys from Syria give you in exchange of kaimutthu? Possibly yes otherwise how can you forget your mother and call Antiochyayeee marakoola.
Congratulations for preparing a reply to Idayanal achan. I think both teh camps should engage i spiritual and intellectual discusion rather than fightingon streets.
Biju, you can expect a reply from one of us. I have not studied it though it caught my attention. Thank you so much and welcome
i think you should write a book about your spiritual journey ad it will help hundreds of youngsters who are addicted ANTIOCH, and help build a strong Indian Church.
I am not here to counter argue with the findings of Biju Varghese – A chavalier in the making. Poor man doesn’t know he needs to pay money. He has presented a reply where you will find takers in the society church. Don't feel I have nothing to argue with. But the proverbs says, not to advise a fool.
Biju Varghese’s presentation is what you call a Varolla as any one can judge its quality by its presentation and can understand what a Varolla actually means.
Biju has written like a man shitting when he has dysentery. Hope he has got some relief. Otherwise it is better to take some strong black tea if he still can’t come out of it. Also make some extra cups for Mathew, Oommen and the likes…… Please don’t add the Karuppu in the tea from Antiochyaaaaaaaaa.
I really had a good laugh when they compared the name of Jacob Burdana in Yakobaya to Christ in the word Christian. That is the respect they give to one amongst the Holy Trinity. Another one was with regard to the Kalpana wrote by HH Mathews II to Perumbally. The quotings which they have quoted from Manorama, Staticon, Church weekly etc. can be found only in the Puthencruz edition under Kappi Canon column!
Over to you Mathew & Co. who is getting enlightment direct from Syria. Do you really shit, sorry sit under some banyan tree like Gautama sat.
What spiritual journey my dear? I have been born in a church where I hardly heard Christ. Instead of Father, Son and Holy Spirit, I was more familiar with Bava, Patriarch and Antioch. Even though we had Bible at home, we were never asked to read them regularly, but were used to do some mundane prayers and rest of the time at the dinner tables it was back to Bava, Patriarch and Antioch. Until I completed my graduation and went to Bombay my world was around these three. I don’t recollect a single sermon I have heard from any of our Priests or Bishops during my childhood or even when I was a youth about Christ and his ministry inspite of we going to the church regularly. Even if something comes to my mind it all ends with affiliation to Antioch. But at the back of my mind I always felt this is not all. There is something missing.
Before leaving for Bombay, I went to our Thirumeni to seek his blessings. He was busy and told me to wait and when he was free asked me, You are now a graduate so there is no point in making you a priest. In a way that is good, atleast you will have your own time for Christ. We are busy with things other than Christ. So in your career if you are able to do something for Christ that would give you reward in heaven. I didn’t understand head and tail of what Thirumeni said because my head was revolving around Bava, Patriarch and Antioch and I saw Thirumeni very close to them.
I don’t want to write any thing in detail. When I look back, as an individual major portion of my brain is carrying concerns of the turmoil in our church. With my experience I can only arrive at one conclusion, lack of Christ in our doings is what is culminating issues in our church. What a heavenly faith we have and a service we got. Where is the time to find solace in them? Most of the time we are busy with boasting, we got that from Antioch and this from Syria. Where do we find time to for the hungry, thirsty and needy? Why does pepsi and coke market their products? To make us healthy? Inspite of these products killing us slowly we still consume them. Similarly some are still consuming the Arabs and Antiochian clad and killing our brothers and sisters with enimity.
Now you see Pradhaman attending a meeting of the Marthoma church. Ofcourse it is none of my business. But the founder of marthoma Church was cursed by the then reigning Patriarch Peter III/IV and ousted him from the church. I have not seen any Kalpana from his successors till date revoking that. Does that mean, Antiochyaye maranallum Marthomakare Marakoola. In short all this Antiochya Bhakthi is all nonsense. As an individual Thomas Pradhaman can even convince Osama Laden. That is he. But who benefits?
This is what I am against. Giving importance to a position which they hardly care for and make others feel that they are stupid. Can’t we call them Hypocrites!
I would like to add a few lines to Saji Thannikkottu's reply to Fr.Valiyaparabil's heretic insinuations against St.Thomas. It is well-known that the 'Puthencruz Society' and its followers suffer from 'Marthoma Syndrome'. In fact, it is an old story. It all started with Antiochene Patriarch Yakob III's infamous Kalpana No.203/1970 dated 27.6.1970 wherein he argued that St.Thomas didn't have a 'throne', but only St.Peter had one. He went on to add insult to injury by claming that St.Thomas didnot even have 'priesthood'.
Well, the Puthenxruz Soceity and its mentors also suffer from another ailment, viz, 'selective memory'. The very same Patriarch had earlier authored a book called 'The History of Syrian Church', in which, on page 149, he wrote:" In the spring of AD 28, Mar Thoma was elevated as Apostle along with other disciples". Again, on page 164 of the same book, it says: "after sowing the seeds of the Gospel in Malankara, he ordained clergy from four Brahmin families, Sankarapuri, Pakalomattom, Kalli and Kaliyankal, which had embraced Christianity." Had the Patriarch forgotten what he had written in his own book? Besides, one may ask: if Mar Thoma was not High Priest, how could he ordain priests?
The ancient inscriptions on the steps of the Madbaha of Rakkad Church under Angamali diocese reads thus: "In 1846, during the reign of Mar Deevannasios on the throne of St.Thomas, Yuyachim Mar Coorilos visited Malankara". (Yuyachim Mar Coorilos was an Antiochene Metran, who was elevated to sainthood by Patriarch Zaka I in 2008). The point is, even in 1846, the throne of St.Thomas was not disputed. Again, in 1912, Patriarch Abdul Mesiah installed the First Catholicos of Malankara to 'The Throne of St.Thomas'. In 1958, when the Catholicos and Patriarch accepted each other by exchanging kalpanas, the letter-head of the Catholicos' Kalpana clearly spoke of the 'The Throne of St.Thomas'.
There is yet another affliction, the Puthencruz society suffers from: viz, 'selective reading'. Let them read the Bible thoroughly and not selectively. But if they prefer selective reading, I can recommend a few passages like: Matthew 18:18, Matthew 19:28, 1 Corinthians 4:14-16. They may also go through the last kalpana of Paulose Mar Athanasios (who was declared a saint by them a few years back) reproduced on page 89 of a book by Fr.Kaniyamparambil Cor-episcopa, one of their prominent clergy.
Interestingly, after slandering and maligning Apostle St.Thomas in every possible manner, the Puthencruz Society has now inserted his name in the 'Thubden' to be read during Qurbana. What a cheeck !
Finally, I would only wish that in order to spite one's opponent, one should not stoop to make heretical statements.
This Is reproduced here for all Jacobites to Read About Priesthhod ?throne of St.thomas
Hai,friends, if my answer to Fr. Edayanal is against facts why he skipped his challenge in the later editions that 'ithilethenkilum karyam thetanennu theliyichal njan orthodox kakshiyil ninnum raji vechukollam'?, I was better knew my answer thim about faction feuds will never give any profit to Christ our saviour or to His gospel, I did a study in pursuance of reading his book,thats all
71 comments:
It is better to decide not to write comments about Idayanal Achan's "velipadu" about church dispute, because everybody knows who is Idayanal Achan and What does he want.
Very well Done Idayanal Chor-Episcopa!!The Perpertual/habitual Liars like H.B.Thomas I and his counterparts modern Jacobites resembles the old testament Jacob Who cheated his own father Issac and brother Esavu for the blssings of his father and wealth.
For self existence and self glorification H.B. ThomasI and his counterparts always try to play around with mafia politics in Malankara.
Moolyail,Kuriakose Chor-Episcopa in his writings to his fellow Jacobites always insist that there were no tomb for Abded Messiah Patrtriarch in Kurkunmel Daira!
KanaiyamParambil Chor Episcopa famous for his "Kappi canon"
It is true and real"ALWAYS TRUTH SHALL TRIUMPH"
also note thatL/L H.H. Yakkob III was not only infamous for his Bull of 1970 whereby he made heretic teachings against St.Thomas The apostle and his Priesthood, while consecrating L/L H.H. Augen I as Catholicose in 1964 he made the Shaumulsa of Mor Augen, under the throne St.Peter in Antioch, For catholicose in Malankara Orthodox Church.Antioch Partriarch L/L Yakkob III is another fraud and deception!!!
Sam P.T.
Dear Joshy
It is not "Velipadu",What ever he he has told is the truth!! You cannot accept the truth!! We don't want you to comment in MOSC/IOC blog/forum without proper reasons!!
great work by Edayanal Achan... congrats achan and keep it up...what he wrote is exactly right. Thomas pradhaman is still mis leading his people. the poor people still believes thomas catholica's nonsense words. thats what his success. Once i got an apportunity to attend the holy mass in one of their (puthencruz soceity's) church in north side. after the holy mass the vicar started his speech. in his speech he made a comment like this "makkale, methran kakshikkarkku pathrose sleehaaye ishtamalla, karanam, nammude zakka 1 thirumeni irikkunnathu pathrosinte simhasanathil aanu"".. see the level of blunder and poison they are injecting on common people. this will still continue. avaru vithakkunnathu orikkal avarkku thanne koyyendi varum....
Joshy
Please do not see matters with a projudiced mind. Study his docuement with a clear mind and see it got some reason. Only that attitude will help us solve problems.
I stay with MOSC basically for two reasons:
1. Patriarch who stays in Arab territory shoulo dbe responsible for Arab Christians
2. The governance of Indian church (for 120 crore Indians) should be done by Indians only.
I am least bothered about any other issues
Basically each one should be responsible for the mission work to be done in his own country. How can the Arab bishops who do not want to work in their own land become masters of 120 crore Indians. (I said this because all nations will turn to JESUS). All Orthodox churches are national churches. Why can't we have it in India. What have Arabs done to us to shout: "AMMAYE MARANNALUM ANTHIOKIAYE MARAKKOOLA"
Geo
I had attended just one Church service of jacobite when I went for a baptism. As you said the priest made a long speech about Antioch and their glory and criticised the MOSC. So this may a regular and routine affair in the Jacobiet churches. Poor people have been fed with this misinformation! I think they are awakennig as the 8th Ausgust meeting in Alwaye proved.
madhyamam reported as thomas metran said.anathikrithamayee pattam eattavarea angeekarikkaruthennu.ethinu vedi ooro pallilum 5 perea nirthiyittundennu.as per syriac voiice.nokkanea kannil kolerunnittu mattullavantea kannilea karadu kanichu kodukkunnathu.eethanu makkalea chanakkeya soothram.
PARISHUDHA MARTHOMAYUDE SlEEHAYUDE SIMHASANAMNATHE THOTTU KALICHAL AKKALI THEEKKALI SUKICHO. THALA POYALUM PARISHUDHA MARTHOMAYUDE SlEEHAYUDE SIMHASANAMNATHE NJANGAL THALLI PARAYILLA... MARTHOMA SLEEHAYUDE SIMHAASANAM NEENAL VAZHATTE JAI JAI CATHOLICOSE. PETTAMMAYE MARANNALUM PARISHUDHA MARTHOMAYUDE SlEEHAYUDE SIMHASANAMNATHE NJAGAL MARAKKILA MARAKKILA MARAKKILA.
MARTHOMAYUDE PINGAMI
SIMHASANAM ATHIL AAROODA
DIDIMOS PRATHAMAN BAVAYKKU
MALANKARA SABHAYUDE ABHIVADYANGAL
ABHIVADYANGAL ABHIVADYANGAL
JAI JAI CATHOLICOSE...
JAI JAI CATHOLICOSE...
JAI JAI CATHOLICOSE...
I Feel most of the things written by Edayanalachan is true. throgh this small article ,he explained the back ground of the factional feud in the Malankara church in simple words.
I am an orthodox follower,but still wish to see the unity in the malankara church.iam sure the leaders of both factions who misguided the church will be punished in the final Judgement of our Lord .
Anil
Edayanal kori has given a challenge at the end of his "historical blunders".... That he will leave the metran kakshis if any of his " findings " are proved to be wrong..
Joice .. Please ask him if this challenge given in 2004 is still valid ? If it is still valid , Koriyachande charithra bodham njangal thiruthi tharam..
Dear Readers,
I have nothing to say about Edayanal achen writings.
Nobody in this world is perfect whether it is Patriach faction or Catholicose faction. Human beings are bound to make sins. Ultimate aim for all is to attain eternal salvation.
Here, the fundamental of both faction i.e. Patriarch & Catholicose faction are totally different. Hence, church unity is impossible. Faith of both factions cannot be compromised. So it has to be divided.
For all knowledge, Churches in Malankara are run by palli committee members & decision taken by palli pothuyogham of that particular church. Bishops have only spiritual powers & rites to do rituals.
In this regard those churches which are run by Patriarch faction will be under Patriarch of Antioch and those churches which are run by Catholicose faction will be under Catholicose devalokam. Catholicose of devalokam don’t have any rite to interfere the administrative matters of Patriarch churches. It seems that Catholicose of devalokam need all the property where the cross is found.
With prayers.
Regards,
Geogy
Satyathil sabha vazhkkine sambadichu itra karyamaya oru prastavana ithinu munpu vayichittilla. thirchayayum ooro malankara nazranikalum ithu vayikkanam. Satyam manasilakkanam
Lahelachan
Dear Joshy & Mathew,
Gone are those days that you can simply counter argue on true facts. Today the people on your side are literally fed up with baseless utopian stories published by Antiochian viswasa Samrakshna Samithi which says that Christianity was brought to India by Antiochian Fathers. Ofcourse it was in Antioch christians were called so but when you blind fold link that to your Arabi Patriachs and Patent Antioch as your private property the problem starts and that is the whole issue we have today in our church.
To prove Edayanalachen wrong, you may have to eat atleast 200 Onams in your life.
What are you asking Joice about Edayanalachen's challege is it still valid? You mean to say that you will not prove it wrong if the challenge is not valid? What does that mean? just Tit for tat. Don't try to cover hole with darkness - that typical Arabi brain.
Edayanalachan has succeeded in narrating the brief history in a very simple language. But from here what? It is time we must stop logical exercises and ascertain ways and means to accommadate the other faction. We had been wasting the last 15 years {since 1995} trying to establish our strong points.But we have missed everything. I mean we have missed our mission and vision.If we sidetrack our mission and vision, what purpose can be served by a history? Yes, a favourabe history too will not favour us. Our blunders all these years are not sufficient for us to learn. Atleast from now, we should keep history in our back pocket and look forward to put into practice what we preach on sundays and what we recite through our promeons and sedaras. Can Edayanalachan take a lead? I am sure if there is a will, there is a way. BUT THE WILL MUST BE THERE. Otherwise, history is waste. As far as I understand, Edayanalachan is capable enough to take the initiative to end up in a unified single Orthodox Church in Malankara.
## George Joseph
Edayanalachen's didn't switch camps. For that matter I too. We embraced unity. Not any particular faction. There will always be people who doesnot like peace. They worked through poor Cheruvally & Perumbally who wanted to become Bishops. The families of those people who were against peace in our church are almost extinct. If we see Cheruvally today as a leader is only because he was cheated by those who were against peace. So like the robber who confessed at the last momement Cheruvally and Perumbally will still find a place in heaven. But those who were really against peace in church will suffer.
Personally I know Edayanalachen will be the last to create a division in our church. But at the same time he will be the last to sacrifice truth and that is the reason why many of us feel that he is admant.
Dear Readers,
If we are talking about unity then all Christian should/must come under one umbrella. Will this happen ?
All belive in trinity. Why all christians be under one single head. It cannot happen, rather it is very difficult. Similar is the case of Patriach faction & Catholicose faction of devalokam.
Whole humanbeing are sinner, all have to repent prior leaving this world to get eternal life. It is not just Cheruvally and Perumbally, but we all, even the Devalokam catholicose.
Regards,
Geogy
Regards,
Geogy
Dear Jacobite Brotheres
There is no Blunderes The Idayanal Chor- Episcopa had written.The Blunders are Created by Some People Claiming Throne for St.Peter in malankara.
Read Bible and Think properly in any Place has Christ appointed St.Peter as Supreme Leader of Dicsiples or whether Christ has told the disciples to follow St.Peter! Peter and The Rest of disciples were told to follow the Risen Christ. Who is The Risen Christ?All the authorieies in Heaven and Earth belongs to Christ.
The Rock is Christ!! or Christ is The Rock!! St.Paul clearly stated this in his Epistles. St.Paul was not ordained By St.Peter. St.Peter recognised st.Paul as himself(peter) and treated as an Apostle Like Peter himself.
Idayanal achan talked about the heretic teachings/heresy of Jacobites and the wrong teachings(history )Sunday school history/lessons of Jacobites.
Sometimes back(2007) I wrote to Mar Dionyasuis of Manjinikkara(jacobite Bishop)to give me details of Ordination of St.Paul as per Acts 13:1-2 whereby he refused to give me a response of my query. he knows the truth.
The faith of both factions basically are the same and no difference except throne of St.Peter and supremacy of Antioch Partriarch. Even The Roman Catholics who claim succession of st.Peter,do not remember the Holy fathers St.Peter,St.Paul or St.Clement or St. Julius on their Sunday Holy Masses/Holy Communion!
There are no special prayers for invocation of Holy Spirit like Orthodox Qurbana in their(R.C./L.C.)Holy Communion.
H.B. Thomas I even made a bull banning/prohibiting Jacobites in receiving/paricipating Holy Qurbana of MOSC. This is called Hypocracy of Jacbites/Puthencruez society!
There are no churches built by antioch partriarch In Malankara. The Malankara churches are governed/administered by MOSC constituition of 1934. Those who formed society in 2002 cannot claim any ownership of church property of Malankara.
For disputed Churches there are court cases and both parties should respect court orders verdicts/judgement as per the law of our country.
There is no need to conduct rally/protest/march, every now and then and proclaim publically we are for peace and true followers of Christ!
Both factions should prove that they real followers of Christ rather than publically accusing each other!
Saare.... Vayaliparambil thirumenide veettuperu koottivilikkan manssanuvadikunnilla... Pandu ithepole oral Vayaliparambil thirumenide veetuperu vechu SOCM forum il metran kakshi vakthavaayi nadichirunnu... Pakshe Vayaliparambil kudumbathilullavar inganeyoru metran kakshi vayaliparamban ullathaayi polum arivilla ennu vishadeekarichathinu shesham angane oru vayaliparambane avide kandittilla... athu saaru thanneyayirunnu ennannu ende aaram indriyam parayunnathu....
athenthenkilumaakatte....
Koriyachande almaarthatheyum kayyilirippum njangalkokke nannayittu ariyam... so aa bhagathekku kadakkathirikkunnatha nallathu...
Pullikarante mandatharangallku marupadi athinde muraykku thannukollam.... athinippol 200 onnamonnnum unnenda kaaryamila.. oru saada malayalide common sense um.. pinne alpa charitra bodhavum undenkil mathi... Gaathikande kalayonnum athinu aavashyamilla....thanneyumalla.. devalokathunnu vaari kori tharunnathu athe pole thirichu chardhikkunnathupoleyumalla...
Koriyachen ezhuthiyittulla aana mandatharangalkku ameen paadunna ningale poleyullavarum athe bracketil pedum ennulla orma undenkil mathi...
Edayanal Achen should be a Metropolitan.Is there any way a married priest can be a Metropolitan..? if cant we all should lobby to change the law.So Edayanal can be a Metroplolitan and a Catholicos later on.He is a Genius and smarter than all the Metropolitans we have.May god bless him.There is other Priests who are very smart but cant be a Thirumeni or Catholicos just because they got married.It is not fair and we should change that practice.
Dear Georgy
Thank you very much for your comment. For your information, There is no faction in Malankara Church. The Hon'e SUPREME COURT upheld the 1934 constitution and under the supervsion of the apex court the election to the office of the Malankara Metropolitan was held. Justice Malimut was appointed as the observer and he supervised everything. After the election, Justice Malimut declared Catholocose Marthoma mathews II as the Metropolitan of the Church. Some people who also paid the Observer's fee did not participate and became rebels. Later they registered theselves as group under the Society act. Whatever be their claim about the status of the Patriarch in Malankara, the SC had ruled that the status of the Patriarch was in accordance with the 1934 constitution of the Church.
So I hope you understand that There is only one and only one Malankara Church.
We are only concerned about the unity of the Orthodox faith and Church in India. We are not concerned about the failure of the Arab churches.(PLEASE READ:NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC COVER STORY on Arab Christians on their website).
But we are concened about rebels and extremists damaging the Church in our country. We stand for unity of the believers, we stand for India, our motherland. When the faithful desert the rebel leaders there is joy because CHURCH IS CHRIST'S BODY! So we are calling once again for UNITY and LOVE.
kaasu vangi Bishappakkunna paripadi oru sabhayil undu. oru Assciation votum venda. Oral vicharicchal (ayal thanne assciation..)
MOSC-yil parisuddh Bava thirimeni vicharicchal polum orale bishappakkan pattilla.
2002 (bharanaghatana???) prakaram achan, thirumenii okke palli thozhilalikal aanu. karanam aare venamenkilum pallikkarkku vilikkam, Pothuyogam koodi venamenkil pentacostil pokam, catholikka sabhayil pokam, venamengil Muslim palli polum akkam, Hindu temple akkiyaalum onnu cheyyan arkum pattilla, Athanu jacobite karude super constitution (?) 2002 edition
I AM SURE ABOUT ONE THING:
MORE and MORE BELIEVERS IN INDIA WILL DESERT ANTIOCH. I do not know where they will all join.
IF Antioch wants to maintain their Indian connection, they have to get the jacobite unified with the mother Church. Otherwise as generations pass by, there will not be anyone to support them from India. I think even before that happens, there will not be anyone in Damascus who call themselves as patriach, if things turnout like this for another decade or so.
I had read an article titled "20 reasons why futue will not hold for Antioch in India"
I saw on Malnkara Syriac Voice
H.B Catholicose Dr. Baselios Thomas I releasing the .......
Where did HB get his DOCTORATE?
I heard he has not even completed primary school education
Fr Edayanal's book is very good, if his intent is to prove that the Catholicose faction is 100% justified and the Patriarch faction is 100% wrong. But if the intention is to create peace and unity, this book and discussions here are not helpful. When there is a difference of opinion or quarrel between two parties, and if the two parties still love each other and if the two parties want to attain unity, they boasting that I am 100% right and you are 100% wrong does not help. This is true in the case of two factions of the same church, it is true between husband and wife it is true in quarrels between two brothers.
If unity is what is desired, the first thing that is required is to understand the other side's perspective. The second thing that is required is to respect the other side.
In the book, Edayanal Achen has said that when Marthoma Church and the Malankara Church parted ways they didnt get anything. This is not true. The only church in which Marthoma Church was a majority, Maramon Church, they got it. In churches where Mathomites had sizable number, they got a turn to celebrate the qurbana.
Similarly after the coonan cross oath, when the Syro-Malabar Catholic rite seperated from the Malankara Church, they also got churches where they were a majority. Churches where the Malankara Nazranis were a majority was with us.
So the concept of giving ownership of a church based on majority has been done in the past in Malankara.
I sincierly hope that, we dont have to go to that extend. I believe if we can establish peace first and have mutual respect, unity will follow. It might take another 100 years for full unity and a united synod. Let us not wait for unity to have peace. Lets have peace now and mutual respect right now.
Most quarrels in Malankara happens because we are not looking farward. When we look forward, we see a nation of 120 crore people. What is role of Arabs here? They should look forward in Arabia, not in India. Arabs have no role to play in India. leave India to Indians. How can a Church which is on the decline in their own land help a nation of 120 crore.
I do not want to follow Antioch because they are a failed church. Alpathil viswsthan adhikathilum viswasthan. Antioch is not a responsible Church. How can be given charge in Indian Church?
Dear Mathew,
When Patriarch Elias III came and told our parents that let us put an end to this division. We didn’t listen. The Kalpana he brought for peace was never read.
Our Vayaliparambil Thirumeni was poisoned and died because he realized peace is what is needed and weeded all those were against creating more division after the peace in 1958. One of the latest breed in our family who is a Priest recently further denounced St.Thomas as Apostle. When he was questioned by me for that, he said, “jeevichu pokenday achaya’.
So you guys discuss in SOCM or in VS or anywhere you like about me, I am least bothered. You can only say that there is no such person called Vayaliparambil Varghese Mathew in the whole universe and may even go to Panchayat Office to get the birth and death register to put up your claim. You want to see me. Come to Thrikkunathu Seminary Chapel. I am there most of the Sundays.
Remember about the concern of the Jews when they realized that boy who was blind got his vision through Jesus. They went on arguing and arguing questioning his parents. They didn’t feel happy in the boy getting the vision. There were more concerned with the publicity Jesus got. This is the trouble you guys have. Even if the Syrian Patriarch excommunicate your society, you will still say Antiochyae marakoola. Because as Jesus said, you don’t know what you speak. So I am not in here for an argument with the dumb heads.
Dear Mathew
You don't need to challenge anybody making comments here in this Blog.You can give facts/information against what Idayanal Achan said/wrote regarding the factional feud in Malankara.We allow you to make comments here, not like socm forum who are behaving like 'Jihad'.
Can you give any history of Antiochean partriarch who visited Malankara /Kerala/Malabar prior to 1875.
If you have any historical knowlegde/back ground of "Malankara Nazrani" you can state that. Devalokam is not political party/Mafia or Propagating Violence/murder in church feud.
Also try to learn when,where the Title "Partriach" came in Church
what was the position of Antioch Partriarch in the First three Ecumenical synods/ Universal synods held in Nicea,Constantinaples,Ephesus!!
Where and when universal synod held for Syrian orthodox church accepted/changed the name into Universal syrian orthodox church!
Meen Pidikkan Pokunna Methrachanmar Sradhikkuka. Licence Illathe Meen Pidichal Arrest Cheyyavunna Puthiya Niyamam Varunnu.
Oru Paniyum Illathappol Meen Pidikkamennu Vachal Athinum VS Sammathikkunnillallo. Bavayekkondu Pinarayiyodu Onnu Parayichu Nokkiyalo?
Idayanal Achan's "velipadu" will go into oblivion one day the moment Devalokam Catholica decides to oust achan from thrikkunnathu semnay and be given in-charge of his home parish- pazhanthotttam because of the poor income for the IOC from that church. Fr. Jacob Mannaraprayil was a bigger lover of St. Thomas throne and critique of Antioch than Idayanal Achan till he was removed from the Seminary after 30 years of “income custodian” of the seminary. Now mannaraprayil achan has gone to Kasi to get Moksham, so one day Idayanal Achan will go to Haridwar to repent his current “velipadu”.
None of these people will talk about the GREAT MARCH IN ALWAYE ON 8th August.
Dear Joyce,please keep The Hindu and Mathrubhumi with you. VISWASASAMRASHAK wil come out with a 2 or 3 lakhs number soon. "Ennamaknkil enniko, Nale kallam paryaruthe"
Dear Valiaparmban
You are great . None can make it clear mor than you! You speak with a great PUNCH.
People like you should write books as it will help many others.
Dear Joshy
You do not have any self respect for yourselves! Mannapra Chor-Episcopa did not Go To Kashy for For "Moksham"as purely a baseless claim by yourselves!He (MannaPra Jacob Chor -Episcopa)still with MOSC and I have participated in his Holy week celeberations in during March this year.
You guys only know how to propagate issues like political parties by concealing the truth!This is how The Society people behave always!!There is no logic in your allegations!!
You will repent one day for all your allegations!
Jacobite Dictionary [complied according to 2002 Society Constitution]
Fornightly: A publication released only once in a month
For expample: viswasa samrakshakan, a fortnighty of the Jacobite Church, is published only once in a month.
If you have doubt, you can visit the site and be 'blessed'. http://www.viswasasamrakshakan.org/
ഹലോ മാത്യു , ഈ വെല്ലുവിളികള് ഒക്കെ ആരോടാ മോനെ. ഇതൊക്കെ ആണും പെണ്ണും കെട്ടവരുടെ പണിയല്ലേ. നമ്മുടെ തോമസ് പ്രഥമന് കാണിക്കുന്നത് കണ്ടു പടിക്കല്ലേ.
താങ്കള്ക്കു എന്തെങ്കിലും കാര്യങ്ങള് തെളിവ് സഹിതം പറയാനുണ്ടെങ്കില് മാത്രം പറയുക.
വെറുതെ ഞഞ്ഞാ മുഞ്ഞാ വര്ത്തമാനം പറയല്ലേ. അതൊക്കെ പണ്ട് നടക്കുമായിരുന്നു. അത് കൊണ്ടല്ലേ നാണം ഇല്ലാത്ത കുറെ പേര് ക്രിസ്ത്യാനികള് എന്ന പേരും പറഞ്ഞു ഇപ്പോഴും അറബികളുടെ പിന്നാലെ നടക്കുന്നത്.
നാണം വേണം മാത്യൂസ്.
Dear GeogyAbraham
You are wrong from the beginning! If you have nothing to comment on What Idayalal Chor-episcopa wrote you should have left the issue without commenting. Actually you do not know What is Orthodoxy or What is the Faith MOSC.Without knowing thses basics how can you comment? we did not force/ make you to comment!You do not even know How did two faction came in Malnkara church,the cause,or the events/circumstances led to split.
There are two things you must know (1)The Teachings/commandments of Jesus Christ(bible). (2)Malankara Church history from A.D.52.you did not try to understand these two things yet make comments on Blog isuue here as if somebody compelled you to do so!!
It Is not church Committe/Church Agm take the stand to which group /faction a particular parish is going to Join /stand. Before even India got independance, Malankara church had a valid constituition whereby all individual parishes/churches are to be governed/administered.
In Malankara the division is initially created By Antiochean Partriarchs for temporal power.
Partriarch of antioch got spiritual authority in Malankara subject to 1934 constituition and canon of the church. Jesus never appointed/authorised St.Peter As supremehead of His Church on earth or His(peter's) successors in Antioch (Partriarchs)
The divided factions united as one in 1958 and until 1970,there were no problems in Malankara church.Then the disgruntled Partriarch Yakoob III,and some of his allies in Malankara started creating division again,blaming Augen I bava for nothing!
It is not Devalokam bava alone or the Shrestan(H.B of Jacobites/P.cruez)Even The Partriarch Of Antioch are there to stand before God for causing all troubles in Malankara Church for as these Spiritual leaders are supposed to behave like real
followers of Christ (god)who humbled himself as a servant/ human being,walked with obedience all the way to death in cross(read Philip 2:5-8) and not of this world(read 1Corin 10-13;3:3-9)
St. paul clearly taught the church in corinth regarding division. now who created this division in Malnkara and for what? Think twice before stoning the MOSC or its Bava!
Sam pariyarathu
I happened to read an article written by Mr. Biju K Varghese in Malankarasyriacvoice.com. I would like to attend the conclusion part of his message:
In fact there is nothing new in that artcle. Supreme Court accepted/ approved 1934 constitution. So whatever Supreme court mentioned is based on 1934 constitution. Spiritual supremacy of Patriarch, etc are part of that constitution only. If both party are ready to accept this constituion there will not be any problem. As he is explaining things just as similar to what is already there in 1934 constitution I think Mr. Biju K V is ready to accept 1934 constitution.
During 1995 judgment honorable Supreme court approved 1934 constitution without any objection as there was not even any constitution to defend it from the other party. Also there was not even any defending Catholicos as there was only one catholicos at that time, ie; HH Baselious Marthoma Mathews II. And the reason for this absense is none other than H.B Thomas I ( that time HG Thomas Mar Divannasious) and his divisive nature though today he is acting like an innocent.
HB Thomas I is a crooked, cunning person born for division whether it is in same group or for the opposite group and a curse for the Malankara Christianity.
And finally he used a term "eunach" in his article to call someone. I wonder who is the real eunuch. Whether it is the one who accepted 1934 constituion in court and stick to it or those who accepted 1934 constitution in court and denied in public.
thanks Edayanal Acha.... in fact, most of the MOSC Christians also not aware of this things. but one doubt remains, why we are not getting a clear cut verdict from Courts if we are 100% right.
Antiochyayil Ninnum AD 52 il Vanna Aa Mahan Aaranu Mone Dinesha...?
Kachavadakkaran Knayi Thoma Vannathu Noottandukal Kazhinjalle?
http://www.malankarasyriacvoice.com/News/aluva.bava.mangalam.aug08.jpg
Puthenkurisu Kunjadukal Thomas I Bavaye Prathiyakkiyanu Casukal Kodukkunnathu. Anganeyanu 426 Casil Prathiyayathu. Example: Thrikkunnathu Seminary Case.
Yesukristhuvum thanum Okke ore Tharakkar Aanennanu Bava Paranjirikkunnathu. Adutha Speechil Daivam Thampuran Onnum Thante Munpil Onnum Allennu Adikkumayirikkum.
Idhehathe Okke Ithrayum Naal Chumannittum Chumakkunnavarkku Naattam Manasilakunnille!!!
I think, the people who put comments here from cheruvally trust (puthencruz soceity,)have never gone thru the book of Edayanal Achan. Just by seeing the photo of Achan, they started barking, Saathan kurishu kanda pole... If they spent some time to read the book, definitely they will not behave like this. The administration and governance of MOSC is clearly based on one central stone, thats 1934 constitution which was accepted even by the jacobite faction in supreme court and lateron denied in public. It is not governed by any individuals under any family trust like cheruvally trust formed at puthencruz.
@ Malankara Syriac Voice
Appreciate you comments. It well written.
Howver, I have seen, someone under the same name, " Malankara Syriac Voice" posting nonsense in the SOC yahoo community.
If thats you, why dont you first practice what you preach.
Certainly these types of unruly news and then idiotic comments based on that, will only create further divisions. So why dont we all, who preach stop it and and give in a try to practice.
Edayanal Achen is not the Manager of Thrikkunathu Seminary. Achen is the Diocesean Secretary. There is no permanent post for any Achens in MOSC. Tomorrow Manaraprayal Achen could be the Manager or even the Diocesean Secretary. Whoever it may be, they are elected democratically and that is the difference between MOSC and P.S society.
Edayanl korikoo marupadi, proof adkkam, vannittunadoloo, ellathinum. Eni ennanooo orthodox pakshthu ninnu maruthe, oru pthraprasthva erkkane, makariyudeyum, milithiyudeyum, athaneyum creation aya puthiya sabhayilekannnoooo.
enthayul kathirunoo kanam.
Dumbheads, Nonsense ennokke swantha nilapaadukalodu yojikkathavare vilichu aaksheppikalle thrikkunathe achaya,..Njangalkkum thirichum ethandu athokkeya thanneya angottu vilikkan thonnunnathu... ini achayane kandu sauhradam koodannam ennum oraagrahavumila... Njaan aluva yil varumbozhokke mudangathe Thrikkunnathu seminaryil pokaarund.. aviduthe vishudha pithakanmaarude kabarukalde munnil chennu praarthikkarumund...
Vayaliparambil thirumeni de marannathil chila duruhathakal ulathu njangalkku nannayittu ariyam... Thirumeni kaalm cheyyendathu aarude aavashyamaayirunnu ennu njaan ivide paranju tharendathillallo ? Thande thalayil maspansa maatti vaykkan vanna catholikkayodum athupole thanne sunnahadosil chanda bhasha upayogicha catholikkayodum Vayaliparambil thirumeni kodutha marupadi naattilokke paatalle ? Thirumeni Kaalam cheythu adhikam kazhiyunnathinu munpu thanne veendum sabhayil prashnangal thudangi, moodi vechirunna Thoma sleehayude simhasanam veendum uyarthezhunettu.. ithokke koottiyum kizhichum, pinne harichum gunnichumokke nokkiyal.... aa duruhathaykku pinnilulla " cerveaux " ethannennu pidikittum.. athinum njaan nerathe paranja saada malayalide common sense mathi....
Idayanal koride postakam vaayichittu thanneyannu ee comments okke ezhuthunnathu.... Ayal ezhuthirikkunna mandatharangalkkulla marupadi vannittundallo.... ini enthenkilum specific samshaynagalundenkil ivide chodikku... ivide thanne aa samshayangalum maatti tharam....
madatharam mandatharamaannenu angeegarikkanulla nattellu vennam...
Thats al I have to say..
Shlomo L'kulhoon !!!
The leaders who clamour for division of the Malankara Church are not visionaries. They fear unity will endanger their position in the Malankara Church.
I will give a parallel example:
THE DIVISION OF INDIA was the most painful experience in the Indian History. India was divided into two because Muslim League leader under Jinnah wanted a Muslim state called Pakistan. They got it finally….Again Pakistan was divided and Bangladesh was formed. Now what is the state of affairs in Pakistan? It had military rule for decades.. Still the military is in control. No real democracy in Pakistan. Many regions in Pakistan are demanding further divisions --Sindh, Punjab, Baluchistan and many other regions. I don’t want to go into the details. Will Pakistan ever become a good nation..? I do not know. But not in the near future. Political analysts say, Pakistan could anytime fall into hands of Taliban the moment US stops supporting Pakistan. So we can imagine that Pakistan is in ICU.
Do our Jacobite brothers want the same fate for their church? When Pakistan was formed they thought they had everything… see what happened later… DIVISIVE LEADERS WILL GIVE BIRTH TO MORE DANGEROUS DIVISIVE LEADERS.
WE are all peace lovers. We want peace in the world, in the nation, in the state, and in the Church, family, in personal life,.. Everywhere.
In the Jacobite Church, decisions are taken by ONE PERSON. HH Didimos Bava cannot make anyone a bishop in the Malankara Church. But just one person can make anyone a bishop in the Jacobite church.
Students of world history know that after the fall of autocrats the nation broke. I am afraid the Jacobite Church is treading the same dangerous path. So Beware! So POLITICALLY SPEAKING the division of the Malankara Church is dangerous.
STRATEGICALLY, the unity of the church will benefit the Church. Think about the benefits of unity. Political leaders, some other Churches all want the Malankara Church to be divided because that serves their purpose well. They encourage Jacobite leaders because they know they are the leaders who demand division of the Church. Once they achieve the division they can destroy both.
Also, division will lead to further divisions. . The power greedy leaders will do anything to achieve heir objectives.
SPIRITUALLY SPEAKING, division of the Church is a sin because whoever divides the Church is crucifying Christ again.
Some leaders are spreading rumors creating fear in the minds of the people. They say that Didimos Bava will take away their churches and property. I request you to maka visit to any Malankara Church and see things for yourself. The administration of the Church is done by the Palli Pothuyogam.. Didimos Bava or any other metropolitan cannot not take away the church property. Their powers are limited to the spiritual areas and will administer the church according to the 1934 constitution.
I have full confidence in the faithful and believe that the Church will remain united. Let us respect and love all people in both the camps. Let us also pray for peace and unity in the Church and in the nation. That is the homage we can pay to our true leaders
Dear all
PC society group always blame and find fault with MOSC.They always think that Antiochean Bava is their God and only through Antioch Bava priest hood is converged in Church of Christ!Simon Peter is rock and He was given the keys of kingdom of heaven,and he was told to feed the sheep ,tend the lamb,and feed my little sheep!.
The don't take into account the context and real meaning of this verses.They never want to be told what exactly Jesus meant by these words.Jesus is the rock and he (jesus) is the corner stone! The apostles /prophets are foundations of Church .It is the faith Peter confessed "That Jesus is The Christ,Son Of Living God"Jesus told Peter This faith of Confession, was revealed to Peter By The Father in Heaven!!
The Same Peter denied Jesus infront of other people three times.After resurrection,Jesus apperaed to Peter,and fellow apostles two times.In The Third time Jesus appeared on sea of Tiberias,where Peter and rest of apostles were fishing.Here Peter was reminded By Jesus his(Peter's ) Mission. Simon Peter was Called "Bar Jonah Simon-Simon, The Son Of Johna ".Peter was not called as Kepha/Peter By Jesus!!
Simon Peter was unsteady disciple of christ since the arrest,trial and crucification of Jesus by jews and Pilate.although Peter saw the risen Christ two times he was still behaving like unsteadily guy! The word Johna means unsteadily person .Jesus called Peter as Simon son of Johna, on the third time appearance after Resuurection!
Peter was restored and commissioned as subordinate Shepherd As Jesus is The True Shepherd(John10:10,14).Peter and other apostles are subordinate shepherds of Christ(1 Peter5:1-4).Again John in His epistles call himself an elder and address the faithful as Dear Little children,Young men,and and fathers(1john 2:12,13,14,15).therefore Peter has the same authority like all other apostles in church.
The four orders in Church governmnt :laity,deacons,presbyters(elders)and Overseer(bishops)are indicated/described in varius Epistles of St.Paul and not in epistles of St.Peter.So the Antiochean Partriarchs who are successors of St.Peter cannot claim any supermacy in MOSC or other oriental orthodox Churches.
Jesus Never gave any supremacy to Peter over other apostles.Likewise The MOSC was founded/established by St.Thomas the apostle, and the successors of of St.Thomas apostle,the Catholicose are not under the authority of Antiochean Partriarchs!
Three groups in the jacobite camp wants to divide the Church
1. UNMARRIED priests who want to become bishops. They know it is difficult to becoem a bishop without proper qualification and tough procedures in the Malankara Association
2. LEADERS, CHAVALLIERS, COMMANDERS who benefit from the Jacobite camp fear lossodf power and lesser glamour in the unified church
3. BIG Churches who want to have their own way. The TRUSTEES and othr local leaders have to adhere to teh principles and values. Itis ordinary member who will beneit when things are in order and run as per LAW.
3.
Gandhi Vs. Jinnah
Beware of the jacobites masquerading themselves as PEACE MAKERS.
If they say that PEACE will come by division, then they are Jacobites.
HH Didimos Bava is like a Gandhi silently praying for unity and peace. HB Thoasm is like Jinnah who want to cut this Church into two pieces. God is with whom?
During teh time of Solomon, a lady wanted to cut the child bccasue she was no real mother. teh real mother begegd not to kill the baby. Thomas Thirumeni, how can you be so cruel. will forefaters who fought for the freedom of teh Church firgive you ever?
My dear antiochian freinds
Attn: Respected editors in malankarasyriacvoice.com/
Is everything alright in ANTIOCH?
Thomas Bav say ok becasue they have construvted a 70 room building (10 rooms for 1 person!)
if you want to know what is happening in Antioch, PLEASE 'READ
World's TOP magazine called 'NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC'
I will give you a link to the COVERSTORY on ARAB CHRISTIANS
(Ishmalites)
Followers of Jesus for nearly 2,000 years, native Christians today are disappearing from the land where their faith was born.
PUBLISHED JUNE 2009
http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2009/06/arab-christians/belt-text
QUIZ
1. what is meant by FORTNIGHTLTLY?
Viswasasamrakshakan says a publication which is relased ONCE IN A MONTH.
2. From WHERE DID HB THOMAS Bava got Doctorate (Ph.D.)?
HB Thomas Bava started his research while he was in the Kolenchery medical college. HB's contribution on leadership and organisational skills are known world over. Recently HB has 'successfully' operated the Largest Ever gatherimg of his church in Kerala. (read the other posts for details)
While HB was metrolpolitan (?) in the Angamali diocese of the Jacobite rebels, he sent a registered legal notice to his own Catholicose (HB Paouluse Bava) asking him not to enter the churches in Angmali diocese and not consecrete anyone as priest under his diocese.
But he has not filed a sinle case against any one but there are 426 cases agaist Thomas Thirumeni. He never files cases as he is not confident about human courts. This is a a proof that he is a living Saint.
Someone had said had HB Thomas made the next Catholicose in place of Dididmos Bava he would have solved all the problem .Thank God it was not given.
If that was given, a permanent blot would have happened to the Catholicoste.
I think there is no point in wasting our time in answering to the commnets of Puthen soceity people. They are all successfully brain washed by Dr. Thomas catholica and they cannot be changed and they belongs to the gunda group "kefa".
i know the cases of some of the churches in north side especialy in ernakulam district, where the kefa members stored weapons in their kefa offices. weapons means not guns or anything, items suitable to their culture ,like stones, iron rods, chilly powder, then provision for making hot water immediately. these are the items recently they applied on our priest and our people at Onakkoor church. one bishop is permanently appointed for giving training for using these items.
when MOSC people conducted one rally at TVM few years back, some people had thrown stones to the police and the rally went wrong. that was a quotation given by a former minister who lost his minister post recently. this minister belongs to puthen soceity. Dr. Thomas catholica who is having the more number of cases against him when compare to Veerappan, is having the knowledge of all notorious criminal activities and his doctorate must be in such a subject.
At Piravom church, the court has appointed three priests permanently and any other priests or bishops from either groups can never enter piravom valiya pally and everybody was following this court order. But few years back, Dr. Thomas catholica entered this church at midnight and he slept inside the Madhbha and next day morning even without taking a bath he did the qurbana. court order is not applicable for him?? then MOSC people filed a case against him for this, but he repeated this again, he enetered this church again as earlier. without creating any issues, MOSC people filed a case against him. but there was no movement from any authorities, because police was in his pocket. then Thomas mar athanasious thirumeni of Kandanadu east tried to enter this church at day time on a parunnal day, then all the kefa gunda pada from various churches came to the scene and created lots of issues, they even attacked thirumeni and the deacon who accompanied him. then the authorities reacted and both parties entered an agreement not to violate the rule. so even if we get a clear court order, these people will not obey that, because they belongs to Syria, Indian Law is not applicable for them, it seems.
so the so called talks on unity is not an achievable one, other wise GOD has to do some miracle.
Dr Thomas catholica?
Who is this Dr Thomas Catholica/?
From did he get his doctorare from? In what subject? Which year?
Can someone help me please?
Any body from ViswasaSamrakhshakan? Syrian Orthoox Voice etc
Last few years Malankara Church has learned a lot about ANTIOCH
1. Antiochian Church is actually ARAB and they learn Syriac like we do it here in Manlankara
2. Antiochian constitution is discriminatory aainst their own people in India.
3. The leaders in Antioch are not very HOLY as we had thought
4. Antioch Church is on the decline
Dear Mathew,
You should now attend classes taken by the latest in charge of the Antiochian movement. He is the latest Gibels. All these stories you narrated are that old Cheruvally edition. Write something new.
You are writing to a person who accompanied Vayaliparambil Thirumeni to Devalokom after the 1958 peace treaty. And you expect me to take that thrash you wrote.
Hope you don't tell your parents that they are not yours!
Thrikkunnathe achaya ( Ippozhum vayaliparambil veettuperu kootti vilikkan manassu varunnilla ).... aarum enne padipikkande kaaryamila... For me Syrian orthodox church is not Thomas I bava or Antiochean movement.. it is much beyond that..... athokke manasillakkiyathu sabha charithrathil othiri thaalparyamullathukkonda....
Ethayalum devalokathunnu othitharunna charithram enikku venda... athu saarine pole mookinappurathekku kaazhchasheshiyallathavarrkku mathi....
Vayaliparambil thirumenide koode devalokathekku poyathil valiya kaaryamonnumilla.... Karthavinde koode yoodasum pesaha bhakshikkan irunnirunnu..
I was checking with vayaliparambil family members about the presence of a metran kakshi " kunjaadu " in their imediate faimly... None of them no somebody like that.. Ee Vayaliparamban ennu oru gamaykkku aalkaare patikkan vechekkunathaanno ? Vayaliparambil poyittu nedumbassery cheriya vayaliparambil ( avarkku Vayaliparambanmaarayitu rakthabandhamonnumilla ) polum oru metran kakshi kaaranilla ennannu ariyan kazhinjathu....
Njaanum aa naatukaaranaanne ...
Hello, Please read the reply to Fr EDayanal of Biju varghese Piravom available in www.malankarasyriacvoice.com
Mathew
Do not read history as taught by Orthodox Church.
You should buy a copy of Kerala Charithram by Padmabhooshan A Sreedharamenon and read.
The independent historian of Kerala has lot to say about Kerala Christians. Then compare it with History as taught by Jacobite Chuch and Orthodox Church. Will you do this?
All nations wil know Christ. So all the people wil come to belive in God. Jacobites teach all true Christain shoud be under Arabi. So our nation will be under Araby? Ha ha ha what a foolish idea!
Arabs are ISHMALITES, and not of Abraham and Sarah
Dear Mathew,
I told you a way to find me out. But Pothinodu vedam odiyittu karyam undo? You don’t have the time to realise the truth but have the time to enquire with each and every member of the family about a person who realized the truth. So don’t waste your time to find me out. Start writing a book that can be published by Antiochya Samarakshana Samithi (don’t expect any royalty) at least you can read it repeatedly when you reach my age and find solace in it.
If you are so proud with what you have, why do you waste your time around here cursing Devalokam. Try to understand, Devalokam or Puthencruz is just less than one percent of the Kerala Population which we realise. Go and speak salvation amongst your heavenly creed at least they will find a place in heaven along with Judas. Oh you don’t have anything like that. Isn’t it? All revolves around that ‘Kya’ I mean Antio’kya’.
Do you know Vellappaly Nadessan has got 2 crore followers in Andhra, I am sure if you guys go and fish around there and speak about this ‘kya’ you will get atleast 200. Why to propagate Gibels stories which even your people started shunning upon. May be you expect a ‘Chavaliar’ in the making!
You people are making churches and bishops like Ulhasnagar duplicate products. If pradhaman was offered the position of Catholicos do you think tadpoles like you will open your mouth? Same happened during the time of Kuttikkattil Thirumeni. He was never consulted and considered for that position, as simple as that.
To amicably solve these issues Puthencavil Thirumeni used to come here occasionally and one Jonie in your lot felt he went their for hospitality!. Nannum kettavande mattedathu………. Athum avanoru thanalla.
He needs to know the story of that ‘champa marum’ which was in front of the Seminary, which this hospitality addicted kuttikattil thirumeni cut to prevent children from climbing on that tree. May be this is not there in your edition.
I know being a Patriarch addicted guy once, the real color of that lot. You are still intoxicated with that. Are you guys still getting karuppu when those guys from Syria give you in exchange of kaimutthu? Possibly yes otherwise how can you forget your mother and call Antiochyayeee marakoola.
Dear Biju varghese
Congratulations for preparing a reply to Idayanal achan. I think both teh camps should engage i spiritual and intellectual discusion rather than fightingon streets.
Biju, you can expect a reply from one of us. I have not studied it though it caught my attention. Thank you so much and welcome
Vayaliparamban Sir
i think you should write a book about your spiritual journey ad it will help hundreds of youngsters who are addicted ANTIOCH, and help build a strong Indian Church.
I am not here to counter argue with the findings of Biju Varghese – A chavalier in the making. Poor man doesn’t know he needs to pay money. He has presented a reply where you will find takers in the society church. Don't feel I have nothing to argue with. But the proverbs says, not to advise a fool.
Biju Varghese’s presentation is what you call a Varolla as any one can judge its quality by its presentation and can understand what a Varolla actually means.
Biju has written like a man shitting when he has dysentery. Hope he has got some relief. Otherwise it is better to take some strong black tea if he still can’t come out of it. Also make some extra cups for Mathew, Oommen and the likes…… Please don’t add the Karuppu in the tea from Antiochyaaaaaaaaa.
I really had a good laugh when they compared the name of Jacob Burdana in Yakobaya to Christ in the word Christian. That is the respect they give to one amongst the Holy Trinity. Another one was with regard to the Kalpana wrote by HH Mathews II to Perumbally. The quotings which they have quoted from Manorama, Staticon, Church weekly etc. can be found only in the Puthencruz edition under Kappi Canon column!
Over to you Mathew & Co. who is getting enlightment direct from Syria. Do you really shit, sorry sit under some banyan tree like Gautama sat.
Dear Ravi,
What spiritual journey my dear? I have been born in a church where I hardly heard Christ. Instead of Father, Son and Holy Spirit, I was more familiar with Bava, Patriarch and Antioch. Even though we had Bible at home, we were never asked to read them regularly, but were used to do some mundane prayers and rest of the time at the dinner tables it was back to Bava, Patriarch and Antioch. Until I completed my graduation and went to Bombay my world was around these three. I don’t recollect a single sermon I have heard from any of our Priests or Bishops during my childhood or even when I was a youth about Christ and his ministry inspite of we going to the church regularly. Even if something comes to my mind it all ends with affiliation to Antioch. But at the back of my mind I always felt this is not all. There is something missing.
Before leaving for Bombay, I went to our Thirumeni to seek his blessings. He was busy and told me to wait and when he was free asked me, You are now a graduate so there is no point in making you a priest. In a way that is good, atleast you will have your own time for Christ. We are busy with things other than Christ. So in your career if you are able to do something for Christ that would give you reward in heaven. I didn’t understand head and tail of what Thirumeni said because my head was revolving around Bava, Patriarch and Antioch and I saw Thirumeni very close to them.
I don’t want to write any thing in detail. When I look back, as an individual major portion of my brain is carrying concerns of the turmoil in our church. With my experience I can only arrive at one conclusion, lack of Christ in our doings is what is culminating issues in our church. What a heavenly faith we have and a service we got. Where is the time to find solace in them? Most of the time we are busy with boasting, we got that from Antioch and this from Syria. Where do we find time to for the hungry, thirsty and needy? Why does pepsi and coke market their products? To make us healthy? Inspite of these products killing us slowly we still consume them. Similarly some are still consuming the Arabs and Antiochian clad and killing our brothers and sisters with enimity.
Now you see Pradhaman attending a meeting of the Marthoma church. Ofcourse it is none of my business. But the founder of marthoma Church was cursed by the then reigning Patriarch Peter III/IV and ousted him from the church. I have not seen any Kalpana from his successors till date revoking that. Does that mean, Antiochyaye maranallum Marthomakare Marakoola. In short all this Antiochya Bhakthi is all nonsense. As an individual Thomas Pradhaman can even convince Osama Laden. That is he. But who benefits?
This is what I am against. Giving importance to a position which they hardly care for and make others feel that they are stupid. Can’t we call them Hypocrites!
Dear Vayaliparamban sir
Even that bit of your lifestory made very interesting reading.
Really had a hearty laugh reading your shot to Biju varghese
Thank
I would like to add a few lines to Saji Thannikkottu's reply to
Fr.Valiyaparabil's heretic insinuations against St.Thomas.
It is well-known that the 'Puthencruz Society' and its followers
suffer from 'Marthoma Syndrome'. In fact, it is an old story. It all started
with Antiochene Patriarch Yakob III's infamous Kalpana No.203/1970 dated
27.6.1970 wherein he argued that St.Thomas didn't have a 'throne', but only
St.Peter had one. He went on to add insult to injury by claming that St.Thomas
didnot even have 'priesthood'.
Well, the Puthenxruz Soceity and its mentors also suffer from another
ailment, viz, 'selective memory'. The very same Patriarch had earlier authored
a book called 'The History of Syrian Church', in which, on page 149, he wrote:"
In the spring of AD 28, Mar Thoma was elevated as Apostle along with other
disciples". Again, on page 164 of the same book, it says: "after sowing the
seeds of the Gospel in Malankara, he ordained clergy from four Brahmin families,
Sankarapuri, Pakalomattom, Kalli and Kaliyankal, which had embraced
Christianity." Had the Patriarch forgotten what he had written in his own book?
Besides, one may ask: if Mar Thoma was not High Priest, how could he ordain
priests?
The ancient inscriptions on the steps of the Madbaha of Rakkad
Church under Angamali diocese reads thus: "In 1846, during the reign of Mar
Deevannasios on the throne of St.Thomas, Yuyachim Mar Coorilos visited
Malankara". (Yuyachim Mar Coorilos was an Antiochene Metran, who was elevated to
sainthood by Patriarch Zaka I in 2008). The point is, even in 1846, the throne
of St.Thomas was not disputed. Again, in 1912, Patriarch Abdul Mesiah installed
the First Catholicos of Malankara to 'The Throne of St.Thomas'. In 1958, when
the Catholicos and Patriarch accepted each other by exchanging kalpanas, the
letter-head of the Catholicos' Kalpana clearly spoke of the 'The Throne of
St.Thomas'.
There is yet another affliction, the Puthencruz society suffers
from: viz, 'selective reading'. Let them read the Bible thoroughly and not
selectively. But if they prefer selective reading, I can recommend a few
passages like: Matthew 18:18, Matthew 19:28, 1 Corinthians 4:14-16. They may
also go through the last kalpana of Paulose Mar Athanasios (who was declared a
saint by them a few years back) reproduced on page 89 of a book by
Fr.Kaniyamparambil Cor-episcopa, one of their prominent clergy.
Interestingly, after slandering and maligning Apostle St.Thomas in
every possible manner, the Puthencruz Society has now inserted his name in the
'Thubden' to be read during Qurbana. What a cheeck !
Finally, I would only wish that in order to spite one's opponent, one
should not stoop to make heretical statements.
This Is reproduced here for all Jacobites to Read About Priesthhod ?throne of St.thomas
There is no one in Malankara who insulted St Thomas like the Jacobites.
When Churches made Thomas stand in the rain outside, Jacobites spat on him too by saying h ei snot even a Priest.
Orthodox Church, is the only Chuch who gave Thomas a chair and made sit inside.
Ippol Ethra Avakasikal!
St Thomas Mount, St Thomas .......
Hai,friends, if my answer to Fr. Edayanal is against facts why he skipped his challenge in the later editions that 'ithilethenkilum karyam thetanennu theliyichal njan orthodox kakshiyil ninnum raji vechukollam'?, I was better knew my answer thim about faction feuds will never give any profit to Christ our saviour or to His gospel, I did a study in pursuance of reading his book,thats all
Vayaliparamban brother, you seems like a person of great knowledge, experience and wisdom.Educate others like this and keep going..nO WORRIES
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